Interview with Cardinal Napier
Oct 21, 2004
A month after Cardinal Wilfrid Napier received the red hat from the pope, Southern Cross editor Gunther Simmermacher, spoke to the cardinal to learn more about the man behind the public persona (March 25 & April 1, 2001).
GS: Congratulations on behalf of the staff and readers of The Southern Cross on becoming a cardinal. How should one address you now? Your Eminence?
WN: I actually would prefer just to be called cardinal. That would be fine with me. The simpler the better.
How have things changed since you became a cardinal?
The first impression I have is that some people want to put me on a satellite around the earth rather than on the ground.
Many people are also terribly concerned about offending me by not using the right title. I’m quite happy with people calling me by the job I do. So if people call me archbishop instead of cardinal, I’ll be quite happy with that, because that’s the job I do.
You have many responsibilities. Apart from your duties as cardinal and archbishop of Durban, you are also the apostolic administrator of Umzimkulu, president of the Southern African Catholic Bishops’ Conference, you serve on committees and so on.
Bishop [Dominic] Khumalo, even though he has retired as auxiliary bishop of Durban, still carries out a lot of the extra functions such as confirmations. But the burden is getting heavier, I must admit.
Will you cut back on your responsibilities?
I don’t know how I can do that. That would have to be done over a period of time. For example, I can’t just give up Umzimkulu overnight. I would have to discuss what can be done with the nuncio first.
Apart from Bishop Khumalo, who are the people you could not do without?
The deans in the diocese are very helpful, they take over a lot of the organisation of the Church in the local areas. That is a great help.
When your appointment to the College of Cardinals was announced, Nelson Mandela phoned you. What did he say?
That was quite interesting. First, he tried a number of times to reach me, but then one of his secretaries left a message on my cellphone, which I didn’t check until late in the evening–only to find that he had left a message that I should call him at 9pm. So I phoned the number that had been given to me and arranged that he would call next morning.
When he got on the line, he said: "Oh, is that Archbishop Napier?" and I said "Yes." And he said: "Oh, thank you, I didn’t think that you would speak to small people like myself anymore." He then offered me his congratulations and said he would phone His Holiness to congratulate him on the choice he had made and the honour he had given South Africa.
And did he phone the pope?
I’m sure he did. I haven’t had the courage to ask the pope, but I’m sure he would try to do so.
Was Mandela’s phone call an expression of a special relationship with you?
I think he was just extremely touched by the appointment, seeing it very much as an honour for South Africa.
Did President Mbeki contact you?
WN: I haven’t had any direct contact from him. I suspect though that there were problems getting hold of me, because I was in Pretoria [for the SACBC’s plenary session] at the time. I have received messages from many government offices and ministers as well as [KwaZulu-Natal premier] Lionel Mtshali, MEC health Zweli Mhhize and Chief Buthelezi. And I’m still going through congratulatory messages.
Do you think your new elevated position will lend you and the Church in Southern Africa greater influence on government and society, especially in moral and ethical questions?
I think a lot of people would put greater weight on what I say because they would believe that I have a much more direct line to the Vatican–which in a sense I have–than before.
So from that perspective people may pay more attention in the belief that what I say has been discussed with the pope, reflecting what the pope is saying. I don’t think it would necessarily mean that they accept what is being said, they may just pay more attention to it.
In years to come, what will stick most in your mind about the consistory at which you received the red hat?
The best thing about it was that my family was able to be there with me. My two sisters and four brothers, and my brothers’ wives were there, and then two of my nieces and my nephew and his wife. My secretary was there, [Durban’s vicar-general] Barry Wood OMI, the chairman of the archdiocesan pastoral council, the youth vicar and the youth worker of the archdiocese. It was a great boost that they were there.
Then the provincial of the Irish province of the Franciscan order, a chap I studied with, was there, and so was the former provincial, who is now an auxiliary bishop in Dublin. The people who were there, that will be what will be stuck in my mind.
The hospitality offered to our party by the Irish Franciscans at St Isidore was absolutely out of this world.
At the consistory itself, standing in front of St Peter’s basilica making the profession of faith and taking the oath of office, and then proceeding to the pope, having the biretta conferred, and the embrace from the pope, those are moments I will treasure forever.
Were you nervous?
Oh, very much so. I didn’t think I was, but the fact that I woke up at all hours of the night before, contrary to my normal practice, was a sign of a certain nervousness. In the morning I felt nervous. But once you get into the flow of things it becomes easier.
The papal masters of ceremony are very helpful. They put you at ease and double check everything. But the worry of making mistakes adds to the nervousness.
Did you have any interesting conversations with the pope?
No, not on this occasion. But in the past, especially when we were preparing the Synod for Africa [in the early-1990s], we would often have working sessions over lunch with the pope during which we made our presentations. Since I was in charge of one of the chapters, I would normally be the one to report on how that chapter was developing.
The pope always showed great interest. That’s the one thing about the pope: he has a way of making people feel that they’ve got all his attention, that he is genuinely interested in what’s going on in your part of the world.
Has he expressed any great interest in South Africa?
I think Africa has a special place in his heart, and South Africa probably even more so.
The pope has called a special consistory, a meeting of the cardinals, in Rome for May. Among the issues that might be discussed is the question of collegiality. What is your position?
What we have developed in the Southern African bishops’ conference region has been a collegiality that goes beyond a college of bishops, in the way we have always related to the priests and especially the laity, in terms of how the laity is included in so much of what the Church is doing. Especially so when the Church is reflecting on the needs and challenges that face us here.
That idea of co-responsibility, which I see as a defining quality of collegiality, has been strongly practised in our region. We may not have developed a strong theology around it, but certainly the practice is healthy. I think that’s the contribution we would like to make at such a consistory.
You and your fellow bishops in Southern Africa have a strong record of engagement in human rights issues, be it South Africa during apartheid or the Sudan today. Do you intend continuing your activities in that field?
Oh yes, maybe on an increased level. Our experience from the Sudan is that people pay attention to the position one occupies.
When we went to the Sudan in March last year, almost everywhere people commented that the bishops of Southern Africa had placed so much importance on what was happening in the Sudan that they did not send just any delegation of bishops, but the president of the bishops’ conference and the first vice-president, Bishop Michael Coleman, and the vice-president of Imbisa, Bishop Zithulule Mvemve. So people would see that in such interventions, the rank of the person sent indicates the level of concern.
Is the SACBC going to become engaged in Zimbabwe?
We usually wait for the bishops of an area to indicate that they would welcome a measure of intervention. That’s what happened in the Sudan. The bishops there turned to us and said they would like to meet with us. In Rwanda and Burundi there was a similar situation in that the bishops there asked us to intervene.
So, if the bishops of Zimbabwe were to express such a need, we would certainly respond to it.
Changing the subject, who has had a great influence on you?
I would place a great importance on the role my parents played in the development of my faith, life and myself as a person. There are a number of people during that early period in my life: my aunt, Lucy Green-Thompson, my mother’s elder sister with whom we boarded when we went to school in Mataliele, was a big factor in us growing up knowing what was right and what was wrong, and also how to regard the Church, live in the Church, and be active in the Church.
During my secondary schooling, the nuns at Little Flower school in Ixopo were a big influence. The boarding master and mistress at the time–the late Arthur Firmstone and his wife Betty, who is now working at a guesthouse, Trefontane, at Mariannhill–were good friends of the family and great influences. He was a very upright man with principles, very much like my father. They were like substitute parents.
Why did you choose to join the Franciscan order?
Because they were the only people I really knew very well. The Kokstad diocese was first run by the Mariannhillers, long before I had been thought of, and then by the Bavarian Franciscans. After the war, in about 1946/47, the Irish Franciscans took over from the Bavarian province. So, in my teenage years, the influence of the Irish friars was very strong, particularly the late Fr Jim O’Byrne, our parish priest for some time. He was a very "he-man" kind of guy that you’d really admire. He rode a motorbike and did all kinds of exploits which had us, as teenagers, look towards him as a model.
When the time came to make a decision about my future, going with the Franciscans was a natural way to go.
When The Southern Cross spoke to your sister Annette, she alluded to things not having gone smoothly when you entered religious life.
I’m not quite sure what she was referring to. It’s probably that my brother went to the Franciscan novitiate in Killarney in Ireland to study for the priesthood a year before me. He stayed there for six months before deciding that this was not the life for him. But that did cause me some difficulty. It made me wonder, if I should go and didn’t like it, would people say: "Hey, these chaps are just having a holiday at the expense of the Church."
I discussed that with the parish priest at the time, Fr Reginald Gunn, and he said: "Oh, we’ll put it in the paper that you have gone over to try your vocation." And if I came back, he’d put it in The Southern Cross again that I’ve gone and come back, and that it didn’t work out. That was very comforting.
You’re known to be a keen reader of this newspaper, and frequently contribute to the letters page. What does The Southern Cross mean to you?
The Southern Cross is a place where we, as a Church, can come together. That is one of the reasons why I do contribute to the readers’ page, because I feel we need to communicate right across the spectrum.
If lay people or religious or priests or bishops wish to communicate, we can do so through The Southern Cross. Of course, we have our meetings, but not everybody can attend these meetings.
I find The Southern Cross is where I can find out what’s happening, what people are thinking. It’s important to know what people are thinking on particular questions.
Has the injury you sustained while playing action cricket (a torn achilles tendon, in late 2000) healed?
Yes, that’s almost back to normal now.
So, have you retired from competitive cricket now?
[Laughs] That remains to be seen. But if I engage in such activities, I’ll try to be more careful in future. I’ll try to behave now like a 60-year-old, not a six-year-old.
Are you also a great cricket fan, like Archbishop Denis Hurley?
I take an interest in all sports. But soccer is my preferred game.
What do you do to relax?
Sometimes switching off just means sitting at the computer. Seeing how this or that programme works. That’s one way.
I go on the Internet from time to time, away from the working field, to look up how the football in England is going. I support Burnley, in the First Division. I started supporting them when I first went to Ireland. Burnley had just won the league [in 1960] on basis of their homegrown players. I’ve followed them ever since, right down to the bottom of the old Fourth Division when they had to win their last game of the season to avoid going out of the league altogether. So I often go to their website to see what the news is on the team and so on.
Another way of relaxing is gardening, both vegetable and flower gardening. In Kokstad that was my great outlet for tension. We had a big garden, and we grew some good vegetables there. In Durban, by comparison, I have a window box. The patch we have is very, very small. But the yard is nice. I’m fascinated by palm trees. I’m picking up seeds all over the place, plant them and then give them a away when they’re big enough to transplant.
And music?
I listen to classical music, and pop as well. One of my favourites is the Credence Clearwater Revival. In the year of my ordination they released a single called Have You Ever Seen The Rain, and the b-side was also very good, Hey Tonight. For a 7" single to have two good sides was very unusual in those days [the late 1960s]. So I took to CCR. Another of my favourites is Neil Diamond. Paul Simon I enjoy, too. Helmut Lotti is another one I like listening to. And going to the classicals, I enjoy Mozart and the Strauss waltzes.
And do you get any time to read books?
Computer books, yes. Books are too much work. But now and again I have a burst of reading novels. One I recently came across was a reconstruction of a detective story set in ancient Rome, the time of Caesar and Cicero. I really enjoy such novels. Wilbur Smith I enjoy, too. Ken Follett is another favourite, also a mystery-detective novelist.
Finally, if you could write your own epitaph, what would it be?
Quite simply the motto I chose as a bishop: Pax et Bonum, the motto of St Francis. I think that has been my driving force as a priest and bishop, working for peace and good will, being at the service of people.
Interview with Cardinal Napier